|
|
Post by wannabechef on Jan 6, 2021 21:36:15 GMT
Well...it turns out I made a minor mistake. I recently sold out of my position in FMIJX (FMI International) to establish a position on PRGSX (T Rowe Global Stock). The TD Ameritrade site allowed me to initiate the exchange so I thought I was able to by-pass the recent restrictions on PRGSX. THE FMI position sold just fine but I saw no movement on the new buy. I called today and spoke with a broker and it turns out I cannot initiate a new position in that fund. Bummer! Tried to sneak in but with no luck. I am aggressively minded but still would like a "core-ish" style holding. This is for my IRA contributions.
Is it worth swinging back to VWIGX (VGuard Int Growth), I have a separate IRA at VG, even though it has had such a strong run-up lately or should I search elsewhere? I debated establishing a small position in PRGTX (T Rowe Global Tech) and then tossing the remainder into my existing PRIMECAP fund (POGRX) just due to lack of options, but wanted to see if anyone else has some suggestions that I could ponder for large Cap International Growth. Any recommendations would be appreciated, I currently do hold PRIDX (T Rowe International Discovery) but I am already pretty overweight mid and small caps so I am trying to focus on larger market cap. Thanks in advance!
|
|
|
|
Post by rhythmmethod on Jan 6, 2021 22:18:13 GMT
You know PRGSX global while VWIGX is int. Depending on your desired foreign exposure you might consider splitting the two. Primecap, due to their contrarian nature might be a decent bet. I hold and am planning to add to POAGX soon. 🤞🏻...rm
|
|
|
|
Post by chang on Jan 7, 2021 0:28:44 GMT
Well...it turns out I made a minor mistake. I recently sold out of my position in FMIJX (FMI International) to establish a position on PRGSX (T Rowe Global Stock). The TD Ameritrade site allowed me to initiate the exchange so I thought I was able to by-pass the recent restrictions on PRGSX. THE FMI position sold just fine but I saw no movement on the new buy. I called today and spoke with a broker and it turns out I cannot initiate a new position in that fund. Bummer! Tried to sneak in but with no luck. I am aggressively minded but still would like a "core-ish" style holding. This is for my IRA contributions. Is it worth swinging back to VWIGX (VGuard Int Growth), I have a separate IRA at VG, even though it has had such a strong run-up lately or should I search elsewhere? I debated establishing a small position in PRGTX (T Rowe Global Tech) and then tossing the remainder into my existing PRIMECAP fund (POGRX) just due to lack of options, but wanted to see if anyone else has some suggestions that I could ponder for large Cap International Growth. Any recommendations would be appreciated, I currently do hold PRIDX (T Rowe International Discovery) but I am already pretty overweight mid and small caps so I am trying to focus on larger market cap. Thanks in advance! I mentioned this a few months ago. I wanted to buy PRGSX at TDA but found I couldn't. (It is listed on the TRP web site as "Restricted" at "some" intermediaries.) So instead I added to an existing PRGSX holding at Fidelity, which OK. I like VWIGX/VWILX, and have a sizable holding. I hear what you're saying about it having "such a strong run-up lately", but I don't know if that should be an obstacle. This is an actively-managed fund, and its managers are always trying to be in the right place at the right time. If you don't have a problem with Foreign Growth in general, why worry about any particular fund's recent success? POGRX and PRIDX are fine options .... but note we are mixing US, global and foreign funds in the discussion, so it's a bit of apples and oranges. If you really want PRGSX (50/50 US-Foreign) then you could split it between POGRX and VWIGX. POGRX is more LC blend than growth, but I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing now. |
|
|
|
Post by javajoe on Jan 7, 2021 1:04:39 GMT
Over the next few years, I think understanding your core foreign funds’ currency hedging or lack thereof is going to be increasingly important... perhaps as important as the AA decision itself.
JavaJoe
|
|
|
|
Post by wannabechef on Jan 7, 2021 1:16:56 GMT
My objective has been to keep my foreign exposure at about 25% +/- 5% hence my flexibility with how I get there. PRIMECAP has a decent portion of foreign equities, which I like, so perhaps a little bit of slicing and dicing is worthwhile for what I am trying to accomplish. chang you make a good point about not worrying too much about recent run ups with active management, I suppose that is why we pay to have the manager to begin with. On the other hand perhaps it would be a concern of we were discussing and index fund. Perhaps a hybrid approach of adding to POGRX and establishing VWIGX is the route to go. I'll sleep on it and likely pull the trigger tomorrow. |
|
|
|
Post by wannabechef on Jan 7, 2021 1:26:51 GMT
Over the next few years, I think understanding your core foreign funds’ currency hedging or lack thereof is going to be increasingly important... perhaps as important as the AA decision itself. JavaJoe Good point javajoe I had, until recently, been in FMIJX which hedges it's currency to the US dollar. This fund was designed to lose less on the downside but gain less on the up side. That most certainly didn't happen in 2020 so I wondered what's the point at this venture? Hence the reason for searching for a new pasture. |
|
|
|
Post by chang on Jan 7, 2021 1:33:14 GMT
Over the next few years, I think understanding your core foreign funds’ currency hedging or lack thereof is going to be increasingly important... perhaps as important as the AA decision itself. JavaJoe Very true. I don't think many people would buy a USD-hedged foreign fund now. The foreign currency exposure is a compelling part of the overall package imo. |
|
|
|
Post by javajoe on Jan 9, 2021 17:25:30 GMT
FMI International actually launched an unhedged version of FMIJX, which I think it telling.
|
|
|
|
Post by wannabechef on Jan 9, 2021 17:58:59 GMT
I had noticed the same javajoe , however the fund is only available at the institutional level starting at $100,000 to open a position in the fund, ticker is FMIFX. When I held FMIJX and saw that FMI was opening an un-hedged variant of the fund and it piqued my interest. However, I held the fund in my IRA and didn't want to allocate that much to the FMI fund. The fund does fine, and Covid is a bit of an anomaly to it's performance so I am willing to forgive that. The question I asked myself is how much upside does it offer? Their reports often confess that they intend to lose less on the downside and gain less on the upside with the fund. Well...the downside has already materialized, and they got whalloped, so now how much upside is left to be had? I think maybe in the future it might be a worthwhile fund, but in my personal opinion I found now not to be the right time for me and my goals. I really do like how they handle market cap, and the allocation they are willing to hold to mid caps. But still, for me, now is not the time to hold on |
|
|
|
Post by chang on Jan 10, 2021 0:50:56 GMT
Their reports often confess that they intend to lose less on the downside and gain less on the upside with the fund. Well...the downside has already materialized, and they got whalloped, so now how much upside is left to be had? Trenchant observation, which applies to many funds. Trying to recall offhand, FPA Crescent (FPACX), Vanguard Min Vol (VMVFX), IVA Worldwide (IVWIX), as well as many classic "value" funds and/or funds that hold large cash stakes (always "waiting to deploy"). Many of these funds got hammered in 2008-09, and hammered again in 2020. What is the attraction of an actively-managed fund that promises to "lose less and gain less" after it's been slaughtered? |
|
|
|
Post by chang on Jan 11, 2021 0:48:21 GMT
wannabechef Not sure if you already made your choice(s). If not, take a look at Artisan funds: - Global Discovery (APFDX) Growth
- Global Opportunities (ARTRX) Growth
- Global Equity (ARTHX) Global Equity
The first two have the same management team, only "Discovery" is more mid-cap while "Opportunities" is more LC. All three are 5* and have done well. Like all Artisan funds, more expensive than the average. The "Advisor" class is a little cheaper and available at low minimums (but will be TF while the Investor class will be NTF). Any of these could be a very good alternative to PRGSX.
|
|
|
|
Post by wannabechef on Jan 11, 2021 1:29:08 GMT
This is great thanks chang . I did go ahead make the portfolio adjustments earlier this week. I added to PRIMECAP POGRX and set up a new position in VWIGX. But nevertheless I will add these funds to my "watch" list for potential future addition, I took a look and I liked what I saw. You're right, they are a little pricey, and pushes to about much as I would be willing to shell out for expenses but I get it that for Int. funds it can get a little more expensive than domestic. The one that caught my eye was: Global Opportunities (ARTRX) Growth Main reason, I use PRIDX (T Rowe Int Discovery) for mid cap int and ARTRX would keep me balanced out. I especially like the fact that their top holdings aren't made up of the usual suspects of FAANG stocks. I think I'll chart this over the following months/year and see how it moves compared to some others, but this does look like a great potential grouping of global funds to keep an eye on. |
|
|
|
Post by chang on Jan 11, 2021 1:42:13 GMT
wannabechef Since you already own POGRX, I think your POGRX/VWIGX is an excellent duo, and well below average expense-wise. Incidentally I am looking carefully at PRGSX (I own some, not a lot) and wondering whether it really is the best global equity fund for 2021.... thinking maybe it isn't. Its US portfolio is very FAANGy, as you implied; in fact, its #1 holding is Facebook with a larger share even than PRWAX, which is an all-US LCG fund. I hate to second guess experienced and successful managers, but I'm not very warm on Facebook now.
|
|
|
|
Post by Chahta on Jan 11, 2021 11:18:29 GMT
Is currency hedging discussed in a funds prospectus?
|
|
|
|
Post by chang on Jan 11, 2021 12:30:28 GMT
Is currency hedging discussed in a funds prospectus? That's a fairly significant feature for a foreign fund—I should think it would absolutely be in the prospectus and very likely in the strategy remarks on the Fact Sheet and other easy-to-find info. |
|
|
|
Post by Chahta on Jan 11, 2021 13:43:12 GMT
I was confusing exchange rate risk and hedging. Yes hedging would be a strategy for investing. Absolutely in the prospectus.
|
|
|
|
Post by yogibearbull on Jan 11, 2021 14:10:59 GMT
Most foreign funds mention currency-hedging among their investment strategy toolbox. But those that really do it mention it prominently in name and/or objectives.
Looking at descriptions of PRGSX at M*, Yahoo Finance and Price websites, PRGSX doesn't seem to hedge for currencies on a big scale. In fact, descriptions mention currency fluctuations among its risks.
|
|
|
|
Post by Chahta on Jan 11, 2021 14:56:39 GMT
I have looked, but would a fund's holdings list some type of hedges like options or whatever they use?
|
|
|
|
Post by yogibearbull on Jan 11, 2021 15:41:00 GMT
|
|
|
|
Post by rhythmmethod on Jan 11, 2021 22:01:08 GMT
wannabechef Not sure if you already made your choice(s). If not, take a look at Artisan funds: - Global Discovery (APFDX) Growth
- Global Opportunities (ARTRX) Growth
- Global Equity (ARTHX) Global Equity
The first two have the same management team, only "Discovery" is more mid-cap while "Opportunities" is more LC. All three are 5* and have done well. Like all Artisan funds, more expensive than the average. The "Advisor" class is a little cheaper and available at low minimums (but will be TF while the Investor class will be NTF). Any of these could be a very good alternative to PRGSX. I've been following this thread with interest. I'm also holding PRGSX. W/O lots of research, it does indeed appear to hold more FANGY stuff than the Artisan choices. It also has 113% turnover compared with ARTRX at 44% turnover. How much confidence one has in PRGSX management to adapt to chance according to circumstances is important, IMO. chang/chang are you currently holding the Artisan products? I'll keep researching this. I def want more global equity but only one LCG in that area. Thanks! |
|
|
|
Post by chang on Jan 12, 2021 0:56:57 GMT
wannabechef Not sure if you already made your choice(s). If not, take a look at Artisan funds: - Global Discovery (APFDX) Growth
- Global Opportunities (ARTRX) Growth
- Global Equity (ARTHX) Global Equity
The first two have the same management team, only "Discovery" is more mid-cap while "Opportunities" is more LC. All three are 5* and have done well. Like all Artisan funds, more expensive than the average. The "Advisor" class is a little cheaper and available at low minimums (but will be TF while the Investor class will be NTF). Any of these could be a very good alternative to PRGSX. I've been following this thread with interest. I'm also holding PRGSX. W/O lots of research, it does indeed appear to hold more FANGY stuff than the Artisan choices. It also has 113% turnover compared with ARTRX at 44% turnover. How much confidence one has in PRGSX management to adapt to chance according to circumstances is important, IMO. chang /chang are you currently holding the Artisan products? I'll keep researching this. I def want more global equity but only one LCG in that area. Thanks! The turnover doesn't bother me so much; that's why I keep it (and PRWAX) in an IRA. The Artisan funds -- no, I do not own any of these. The only Artisan fund I own is Developing World (APDYX), for several years; and it's a keeper. I was just doing a little looking and comparing. PRGSX has a stellar record and I wouldn't want to second-guess it. All TRP growth funds are very FAANGy, which is why they have done so well in the last couple of years. Ultimately, though, it's my money (or your money, or his money, etc.) and we all have to reconcile our confidence and comfort with our investments with whatever other concerns, ideas, experiences, etc. we have, and choose an AA/portfolio that we can live and sleep with. I have a big slug of PRWAX in my Roth, so I was just turning over the wheels in my head wondering if PRGSX was really the best complement to it, or not... |
|
|
|
Post by wannabechef on Jan 12, 2021 14:38:46 GMT
In an effort to further muddy the waters on this thread, I had considered using RPGEX (T Rowe Global Growth) as an alternative to PRGSX once I learned it was restricted/closed. RPGEX can be bought at any brokerage from what I have gathered. It holds over twice the holdings at 180 total compared to that of PRGSX which is 78 total, so a little but more diversified. Turnover is a little lower at 85%. And even more interesting is the fact that while the fund is labeled a Growth fund it is slightly more "blendy" than PRGSX, with a little more Mid Cap Growth as well. Record is similar to PRGSX since 2008, and it seems to have performed as expected in early 2020. The Artisan Global Opportunities fund we discussed (ARTRX) looks to have held its own against these two funds as well even with the higher expenses.
All in all the Artisan Global Opportunities (ARTRX) and T Rowe Global Growth (RPGEX) funds are ones I plan to watch over the mid-term. Still scratching my head as to why T Rowe restricted access to PRGSX to very few brokerages with only $6.6 billion in assets. Compared to how large many of their other open funds are, PRGFX for example at nearly $68 billion, it didn't make a lot of sense. I think I'm still just a little pissed that I had planned to use PRGSX once the new year turned over when I dumped my FMI international fund FMIJX, and I lost my chance for the time being.
|
|
|
|
Post by johntaylor on Apr 3, 2021 14:21:16 GMT
Own some of Global Growth Stock. Just note that some past returns came from a smaller AUM.
|
|
